I've been reading about the old days of UFC and came across a fighter named Joe Son. If you look at his MMA record on his Wikipedia page, you'll notice that listed under method for his losses are:

  • TKO (Shoulder injury)
  • submission (terror)
  • submission (elbow injury)
  • submission (blood choke)

If I go to the Wikipedia page of his opponent, Joe Moreira, and see his MMA record, you'll also see he won his fight against Joe Son by "Submission (terror)". You can see that, in both cases, the defeat/win occurred in round 1 and the time given is N/A.

This is really making me wonder what happened. The only way a time of N/A could be right is if the match never even started, yet Round 1 is given as the Round in which the defeat/win occurred, so I have no idea what's happened.

I searched around, but couldn't come up with an answer; I only came across a forum containing unsubstantiated stories about what happened, with some interesting ones, as this Joe Son guy was convicted of a number of crimes and is currently in prison.

Videos of other matches Joe Son competed in can be found, such as this one titled UFC4 Legal groin shots Note: It's a bit graphic

1 Answer 1


I think the answer can be found in the Wikipedia page you linked to, in the section "Mixed Martial Arts Career"

On April 12, 2002, Son also took part in Xtreme Pankration 2, wherein he faced Joe Moreira. After a brief exchange of strikes, Moreira landed a hit which drew blood, and Son then refused to continue fighting, and the fight was called. The result was officially listed as "submission (terror)".

I shall point out that this is marked with "citation needed" in the Wikipedia article; I can't find any other evidence either way.

  • Hmm, sorry I missed that explanation in the article. I wonder why the time wasn't recorded. Is that a term you're familiar with? Submission(terror) when talking about combat sports? Like what's it called in boxing or kickboxing when a fighter doesn't want to continue?
    – Zebrafish
    Sep 12, 2018 at 15:45
  • It actually says "clarification needed", but obviously a citation would be needed also. At mixedmartialarts.com forums mixedmartialarts.com/forums/UnderGround/… someone says: "I do believe that that's the fight in which Joe M "bitch slapped" Joe Son right off the opening bell so hard that he walked back to his corner and tapped." Though this too needs verification.
    – Zebrafish
    Sep 12, 2018 at 15:53
  • So it does! I guess I didn't read it properly and my brain filled it in with what I wanted it to say!
    – Mike P
    Sep 12, 2018 at 15:55
  • Oh, I see now! This fight wasn't at a UFC event, it was at something called Xtreme Pankration 2, and this "submission(terror)" must be specific to this event maybe.
    – Zebrafish
    Sep 12, 2018 at 16:00
  • This is probably the correct answer. Here's another unsourced source from an old Sherdog thread that says the same thing: forums.sherdog.com/threads/tell-me-about-joe-moreira.1844089
    – coinbird
    Sep 14, 2018 at 21:32

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