5

I had a talk with a pupil a couple of weeks ago about, who complained that she did not have the finger strength to grip an attacker for a subsequent sweep, because of arthritis. My suggestion to her was to use the elbow joint instead, which she tried and found slightly easier, but still not optimal.

This has started a thought process for me: as the question Self Defense with One Arm Full also states, you never know what situation you will be in if you are ever attacked.

I like to grab the attacker, as a way to disable that limb/steer his/her next attack - but without grip strength, what kind of controlling operations could I implement?

I am aware of kyuhsu as an alternative, but I make my pupils aware that if their attacker is affected by e.g. drugs, they may have a higher pain threshold.

Jabs to the thorax, to stop the attacker I would not prefer for an initial control - I see this as an escalation.

6
  • What are you teaching exactly? What is the goal here? Also what is your own training. You can't teach what you don't know yourself, so all these will have an impact on the answers.
    – Huw Evans
    Commented Jan 2, 2023 at 13:22
  • I teach Okinawa Goju Ryu,
    – JoSSte
    Commented Jan 2, 2023 at 13:28
  • Ah I see. So you are talking about grabbing an arm?
    – Huw Evans
    Commented Jan 2, 2023 at 15:12
  • 1
    This is a bit of a hot take... but doesn't that sequence work without controlling the arm anyway? I mean you won't get always get a controlled takedown but you already have the leg and the throat so why do you need the arm too? Otherwise you could try wrapping the arm around the attackers arm? youtu.be/VW7-Qjfegok?t=200
    – Huw Evans
    Commented Jan 2, 2023 at 22:24
  • 2
    I would just tell her to train as best she can and alter it according to her own sensibilities even if it doesn't look true to form. She should be her own teacher, as should everyone. I'd also recommend taking up taiji instead or in addition to Goju. Taiji utilizes elbow and shoulder strikes while developing a strong core. Grabbing is rarely done in taiji, at least in the "hard" way where a fully clenched fist is made. Commented Jan 3, 2023 at 17:39

3 Answers 3

5

Self-defense has to be individual. If this person cannot grab with their fingers, any technique that involves grabbing with the fingers simply does not make sense.

My personal intuition would be to build more around trapping (entangling) the arm for direct (hard) control and balance manipulation, and use a more simple and (soft) grip strategy where you slide along the arm and "get stuck" at the elbow or wrist with a pincer grip between thumb and fingers (mostly 2nd and third, pinkie nad index are not involved much). This is much easier on the joints and requires a lot less grip strength than grabbing cloth. And it is enough for guiding opponents' movements and manipulating their balance. Another plus point is that it works perfectly without clothing.

So basically, you either trap limbs completely or you use a pincer grip with less hard control (keeping where you want it) and more soft control, where you do not stop movements but redirect and steer them the way you want. This requires much less strength and joint stress.

Go-ju Ryu - hard-soft.

Edit to address the sweep: You can, for example, redirect a straigth right-hand punch diagonally with left, entangle with your right arm, and use your left to turn the head with an open hand strike and control the throat for backwards-force. If you have good timing and tai-sabaki (re-positioning to the right side of your opponent) while doing that, it is quite easy to sweep their right leg with your left using this position and control. Also, you are pretty safe there.

Mind, you need to control the shoulder on the side you sweep to move it forwards/sideways. Whether you do that with a (lapel) grip on the chest, a diagonal arm entanglement, a straight arm entanglement/grip, or even an underhook does not matter much for the mechanics of a sweep. The main difference is the different relative body position and direction of the sweep for each type of shoulder control.

1
  • Self-defense has to be individual. So true. Every student, and more importantly, every teacher, is advised to remember those words. Commented Jan 31, 2023 at 10:15
3

Might it be easier if they grab a different part of the arm or perhaps the sleeve? For example it's easier to grab the wrist further towards the hand. Grabbing half the hand and half the wist is even easier. You could also try having them grab the sleeve.

What works is going to depend a lot upon the individual. This is the point of the Japanese Expression Shu Ha Ri as found in many Japanese martial arts.

I am sure you are familiar with this but for any other readers:

Shu is the first stage of learning where you imitate the instructor.

Ha is the second stage of learning where you adapt and experiment with different ways of doing the technique as you understand it better.

Ri is mastery where you adapt the way you do the technique to work best with your own body.

It's great that as an instructor you are thinking about this. Ultimately though it's for the student to learn how to do the technique for themselves.

Famously among Shorinji Kempo students there is a 9th dan who lost his arm below the elbow. He can still do most of the techniques, but has to be a lot more brutal when he does wrist locks. I have a pdf of a magazine excerpt (with translation) where he has a breakdown of how he adapted his techniques.

I'll include a link to this as an edit if I can find one.

4
  • That article sounds intriguing. It is an ingrained part of my way of thinking that you should choose the techniques that work best for you and your body.
    – JoSSte
    Commented Jan 4, 2023 at 10:08
  • 1
    Unfortunately I can't find the source where I got the pdf. It's copywrite material so I can't repost it either. No idea if the magazine still exists as a business though.
    – Huw Evans
    Commented Jan 4, 2023 at 16:32
  • I had a brainstorming session (rather a try-stuff-out-on-each-other session) with my fellow instructor, and we found som applicable elbow locks that seem to work, where she could use her wrist (which is not burdened by arthritis yet), and then do some takedowns, Could you post the name of the Shorinji Kempo 9th Dan sensei So i might do some research?
    – JoSSte
    Commented Jan 4, 2023 at 20:07
  • I'll try to find it for you. It's written in katakana on the cover of the magazine, but I can't read Japanese.
    – Huw Evans
    Commented Jan 5, 2023 at 17:22
2

Your question reminds me that children are occasionally taught techniques using open tegatena so as to specifically avoid grabbing. This is done for the purpose of teaching the shape of the movement, rather than the technique itself, since among other reasons this reduces the technique to a more basic level without interference from a poor posture by uke, and reduces chances of over- or under-performance of a movement which might injure.

But your question also reminds me that arthritis - which I suffer horribly from, albeit in the hips - is but one of a myriad of things that can go wrong. One may have a sickness, or injury, or a hand that is occupied (eg, holding a child or a weapon). In these situations, one must take care to understand the underlying focus of the technique and then adapt when the optimal body part used to effect the technique is not able to perform its function. Hands and fingers can become jammed, smashed, cut, burnt, or over extended during any altercation. Maybe even you have a weapon, are you going to give that up to effect a grab?

Your instruction would be incomplete without coming up with scenarios that a student might encounter - injury typically, but an ailment like arthritis is just as good. What does a one-armed student do? Or a student without a hand? Or Leg? As such, this is an excellent question to bring up.

There is no easy answer, since no one answer covers for all scenarios, but you could make the argument that the opponent's own momentum should dictate how they are handled.

So, using your example, some throws which you might have done by sweeps and grabs could be effected by lowering to the knees, forcing the advancing opponent to trip over you. In fact, that lowering of your body by kneeling can often be substituted for many grabs and throws. As you are an instructor, I trust that you could easily come up with many scenarios which you could swap out the grab for a kneel, a spin, a duck, a step here or there. Where you might have issued an atemi to slow the advancing opponent, you omit it in order to keep them moving so that they entrap themselves.

This won't easily work all the time, and you might have to break rules here and there. Perhaps, one hand is no good, but other is fine, so maybe issue a technique allowing a shift to the other side might work.

An example of breaking a rule: instead of stepping away from an opponent, you simply turn the torso to the direction of the would-be step. Try this when you have no functional issues, and your instructor is liable to spend time making corrections about stepping. But if a student cannot turn and step, and turning the torso is all that can be done, then that's what will have to do, even at the cost of having to muscle through a technique.

As it is, I am myself exploring how to adapt with occasionally debilitating arthritis. No more kneewalking or suwari waza for me. And my taekwondo kicking days are all but over. So I am curious as to what other answers you may get.

1
  • 1
    Your answer reminds me that we have a highly graduated instruction in Goju Ryu from England who is wheelchair based. It is inspiring to watch him instruct in self defense and even his adaptation of some of our katas, which he has clearly practiced spinning it and using it and some extra hand movements in place of kicks.
    – JoSSte
    Commented Jan 4, 2023 at 10:05

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge you have read our privacy policy.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.